Conquest of the Horde

One of the things I've got to say, Loxxy, is that OOC here on CoTH, you've been one of the most kind and caring persons to ever be on the server. Back when I was a GM, and waaay more aggressive I did not even know how to handle you. You were so... nice, and player centric. You had -crazy- ideas, like some sort of GM shrink to hear out issues. You made me frustrated beyond all belief because I could not believe someone like you -existed- and was a -GM- on COTH, the strict server of strictness.

Boy, was I being silly. Over the years I think you've influenced a change that I could not have forseen due to the fact I always thought I was right on things... you made this community friendly. You made it so it wasn't odd to see players RPing with GMs, outside of their little cliquish groups that dominated certain areas like booty bay and Silvermoon. You've shown the players that most if not all GMs are -human- as well, despite the fact that you are all trying to maintain an order on the forums and in game, and despite the fact that -sometimes- you have to see a friend get banned because they are being a ninny-muggins. (Spell-checker did not freak out at that word. Awesome.)

The latest thing I've been reading about is your RP here, the kidnapped thing. It jumped to five pages over night, then ten within the span of two days. I thought that was crazy. It's -insane- for me to comprehend a roleplay that big, that full of people, because I honestly have the attention span of a flea. However, I have seen the issue Wuvvums brings up as well... and while I agree with her that there's a lot of the deus-ex-machina going on, along with some oddities that are never addressed...


I have to disagree with her in this way. I think it's perfectly fine that those inconsistancies exist. I think it's great that there is some restrictions that are explained with "It's just like that.". The reason is because this event has become gargantuan. While there's plotholes and misnomers, it doesn't matter because it does what CoTH sets out to do, and that's create some roleplay. Back in the day, we -lived- for all sorts of roleplay.

Killing Time-eating dragons. Getting gifts of succulent pig meat and women. Kicking bears in the groin because that would totally K.O. one. A tribe of undead trolls and other misfits that roams around the dead scar picking up bodies. It's that sort of "What the hell" sort of roleplay that -built- back in the day. I think I killed it, to a large degree, with trying to bring the factions to hating eachother when stuff was actually... neutral. Between the Alliance and Horde... they were at a point where humans had undead and Orcs in the city, and it -did not matter-.

I miss that sort of stuff. I never thought I would, but I do. So to me, it's good to see a roleplay where the reason for everything is to -have fun-, instead of worrying about all the facts that should be present, because it needs to be serious. Let the RP opportunities present themselves, don't sweat the details, roll with the flow, and have fun.


Honestly Lox, thanks for making CoTh a fun and nice environment.

... Thanks, Rensin. <3

Ahem.

Kidnapped. Now that the event is actually over, I'd love it if I had some more feedback on how the event in general worked out. I've taken to heart what's already been said as far as the Deus ex Machina goes and I've answered to the questionmarks regarding Faceless' almost insane vitability during the final fight. To recap, though;

• - Deus ex Machina: Some things that happened in the event weren't as "open" to alternatives as others. Like certain potential escape roads weren't actually possible to breach until later in the event for storyline purposes mainly. (It would've been extremely boring to have the event end a few days too early because I'd forgotten to put a plug in a hole I failed to see.) Looking for options is fine. I can't always give you proper reason as to why it wouldn't be possible, however. Sometimes it's because I really can't think of something sensible on the spot, and sometimes it's because you wouldn't know why it isn't working until you've actually tried it, and not even then in some cases!
  
  - Faceless in the final battle: She was pumped on various potions. In her initial Raid Emote where she stood up behind the altar, she tossed aside two vials she had just emptied. For entertainment purposes, I have her those vials in order to let her live for a little bit longer so to not make the last fight completely pointless. I'll put it this way, from her perspective: "If I'm going to go down, I'll just make damn sure I'm taking them all with me!". While she didn't succeed with that, she did KO plenty of people in the final fight. ... And apparently one person died, though I'm not too sure. I only heard about it through proxy.

Other issues/suggestions that've been brought to my attention since the event ended (thanks Rigley, Grakor and Xigo!):

• - Guards: The balance between the guards and the victims was a bit too skewed. Especially with the involvement of the Enslaved Guards, since it effectively outnumbered the Kidnappers and there wasn't much opportunity for the Kidnappers to really be their roles when their numbers couldn't back them up against the Victims and the Enslaved Guards. If they did anything on the wrong time of the day when not many Kidnappers were online, they risked causing severe damage to their character since there was no one to back them up.
  
  - NPC Guards: The lack of NPC guards didn't help the above mentioned issue. In the past Kidnapped events, there were always NPC guards stationed throughout the area and everyone was always made aware of their existance so that it was more intimidating to actually attempt something drastic, like escape attempts or openly plotting against the Kidnappers. Many Victims got away with openly speaking of how they planned on murdering some of their captors, for instance, and there was little they could do about it. In past events, the NPC guard presence added to the atmosphere and their absence this time around was notable.
  
  - The Area: CAVE WAS BETTUR. I agree. I'll have to consider reusing old areas at this point, because I heavily favoured the old areas over the Monastery, though it gave a very nice touch.

... I probably forgot some stuff. Please fill me in if that's the case. And do post more stuff here, as I very much appreciate all the feedback I get and it only helps me make future events more enjoyable and fun for everyone involved.

(Yes, I know I didn't finish the intrigues. I'm very sorry!)

I really only did kidnapped 2, was there any other kidnapped where guards could have been held accountable for inciting a riot? I don't remember that happening before, in fact, usually the prisoners were the ones inciting their own riots and no matter what, rioting was always on them to get punished for it. I do feel like guards had little opportunity to be "mean" in this event, and they would also get in trouble for it.

I felt from the moment "faceless" died there was a lack of threat or a reason for characters to be afraid. I heard this also happened in Kidnapped 3, but not as soon as the middle of the event. I felt like aside from the finale the rest of it was social rp. You can't really force the characters to turn on one another and be conflicted if they don't want to be, so it's probably good to always have some sort of NPC presence to keep characters on edge.

WELL KIDNAPPED 4 WAS MY FIRST KIDNAPPED. SO HERE COMES MY CLEARLY BIASED OPINION...

-The plot twist was awesome and unexpected. That said, I think you did stack the drama against a little too heavily, I mean, at its apex, we had bomb collars, a volcano about to erupt, a ghost haunting, a food storage, and a lung disease ALL AT THE SAME TIME, along with being unable to escape. I think we could've done without one or two of those, but I hardly feel their inclusions was detrimental from the event as a whole.

-I personally loved the location. You did a great job decorating it, and that really made the place feel like its own area and not the monastery, even with the giant crazy chapel/mausoleum thing in the back.

-Character ratios I think should be better enforced next time, though. Like for every X Kidnappers, you have Y Unwilling Guards and Z Victims. The number should increase exponentially, as to allow growth. Something like for every 2 Kidnappers there is 1 Guard and 1 Victim slot available, I dunno. Most of the Kidnappers weren't on at the same time, but the Guards were, so yeah, that probably had something to do with it too. NPC mooks might help out here, too.... plus give us something to fight when the next inevitable break out occurs.

-I felt the event lasted one day too long. The two days of RP after we got our collars removed were mostly just TENSE SOCIAL RP, which was fine and fun (I honestly enjoyed it), but as a whole I think it contributed to player burnout. Just one "intermission" day would've been fine, imo.

-THE VOLCANO NEVER ERUPTED. I was wanting to escape the fortress while a crazy volcanic eruption occurred for MAXIMUM OVER THE TOP BADASSERY.

But in all seriousness, the event was great, and you're awesome. Looking forward to Kidnapped 5: Faceless is a Death Knight :P

Some other things about Kidnapped that we mentioned, but want to have here so it's written down somewhere...

Shock collars. Explosive ones are too dramatic and never get used because they're too...lethal. Also, the enslaved guards really should have been able to use magic. If they can carry around gigantic axes, giving them magic isn't being too liberal.

RP opportunities for the enslaved guards seemed really limited. Most of the folks they interacted with were on hostile terms: the willing kidnappers. Since there was such a small gateway, guards couldn't really interact with the victims save in whatever antagonistic efforts were being implemented, which were significantly fewer this time around. I think the only major action the guards took this time was that one time they brought them into the arena to fight. This was at least caused by one major flaw this time around...everyone was released too early. I enjoyed it when it happened in Kidnapped 3, but freedom happened slightly before the halfway point in Kidnapped 4, which seemed very...odd.

Certain characters felt like they were getting too focused on, leaving other players in the dark. It's somewhat awkward that, ICly, most of us still don't know exactly what happened when the fake Faceless was killed. This was definitely something that needed more attention too, and too many of the guards completely missed it.

I'm glad that this Kidnapped had more racial diversity, though I'm not sure what provoked it.

OhyesIforgotaboutthose. Thanks for reminding me!

(04-19-2012, 09:05 PM)Grakor456 Wrote: [ -> ]Shock collars. Explosive ones are too dramatic and never get used because they're too...lethal. Also, the enslaved guards really should have been able to use magic. If they can carry around gigantic axes, giving them magic isn't being too liberal.

^ Oh man this would've been great. Gantrithor would've become a goddamn lightning rod had this been the case. Use it for Kidnapped 5!

(04-19-2012, 09:05 PM)Grakor456 Wrote: [ -> ]I'm glad that this Kidnapped had more racial diversity, though I'm not sure what provoked it.

SO MANY ORCS.

And a couple of trolls, night elves, a gnome and a dwarf! Some forsaken, too, but Lucrezia sorta fell off the face of the earth, and Markus got killed. Blood elves were still the most abundant race, but there was a distinct lack of humans (Gregg, Cristovao, and Clovis were it I think. Oh, and Dino).

Oh, and there was Gantrithor pimping it up as the bawss draenei. Diwaata was there too but Immy hardly got to participate :'c

Yeah, it was pretty awesome.

Because bump-spree.

I'm not one for long feedback posts, so yeah.

I love ya, Loxy. <3 All of your Belves I've had the pleasure to RP with over the years have remained unique and interesting, despite them all being of the same race. As for your DMing, I didn't have the chance to be involved in any Kidnapped besides the very first one due to IRL stuffz, but I will be honest and say it was the best event I have been involved in and remains so to this date.

Um. I feel compelled to try to give -some- constructive criticism here...

Besides thinking you should RP WITH ME MOAR, I think you should branch out from Belves for a bit. You probably have other races, but I haven't seen them. :C Try to develop them as you do your Belves, just to give a little variety.

EDIT: Forgot to mention your GMing! You remain helpful and loveable through all of these nubs asking you questions and asking for stuff. I don't think I've seen you 'lose your cool' with anyone. Ever. You're totally my favorite GM.

<3

DEAR LOXYBOX

WE SHOULD RP

SIGNED

CAPPNHAIR

I won't talk about kidnapped because it's almost done and there are still things you have time to do that I may say. I feel it would be unfair to call out something I think you should do and you might do anyway. My #1 loxy Feedback is one of your largest strengths and weaknesses. Your versatility. It is awesome that you have 30+ characters, it is awesome that they are diversified to you and the close people around you but having so many characters you only develop them in actual RP about 30%. As it is excellent to have many alts in many guilds it is difficult to build a story off one of your toons since they disappear so quickly due to your interest. You are a Gem who could really be the foundation or the focal point of any healthy storyline but you never stick around long enough to be so.

I loved the event, Loxy. I can only compare it to the third one, as that's the only Kidnapped I've participated in aside from this one, but to me it's obvious that you've made great leaps and bounds with these events. I'd like to see them improve even further, so I'm going to try and put my thoughts on metaphorical paper.

The main good thing, in my opinion, was that you guys really made the event come alive this time. For me, what made the roleplay interesting wasn't the vast potential for social interaction and character development that Kidnapped offers (though it did play a role, if a smaller one) but instead the 'richness' of the whole setting and environment. A number of things contributed to this. First, there were those little NPC-based touches - Emma, the interviews, the whole Standard/Generic business. Some of those were already there on the first day of the event, and I don't know about anyone else, but that made me pay closer attention to what was going on. The ultimate result of that was greater immersion and a greater deal of depth, which was very nice. Then there were all the new things you tried, like the pre-made characters or the new approach to magic. These definitely worked well. They added their own thing to the atmosphere, be it the shadow of Meadowrest looming over the goings-on (which I, personally, found to be eerily discomfiting, and that fit the event well) or pushing the setting away from the generic (ahah) you're-in-prison feel. But what shone brightest of all - and everything I mentioned above added to this effect, too - was how stimulating and well-fleshed out the story was. This, if I recall correctly, was something Kidnapped 3 lacked. The elemental, Naneth, and the island's supernatural qualities and the bears oh my god this is just like lost all joined in to build a whole new level of intrigue, which was only intensified by Faceless' demise. That last bit was a big step away from Kidnapped's usual course and came as somewhat of a surprise. I admit it left me thinking something along the lines of 'Ooh, this is new'. So basically, what I'm trying to say here is that Kidnapped 5 was really captivating most of the time. I recall Kidnapped 3 as a very good event, but a bit bland story-wise. This one had no such flaw.

I think I only have two legitimate complaints. The first of these is more or less an echo of C0rzilla's feedback in the event planning thread. I don't think it was that big of a problem, but I did notice a certain lack of resolution and there were quite a few plotlines (e.g. Vienne's) that, despite contributing greatly to the general feel of the event, weren't exploited to their full potential. But really, none of this detracted from the overall enjoyability of the event for me, so I'm not going to dwell on it. My second issue is with the final event. I think it was rather anticlimactic. Personally, I expected something more interesting. Not necessarily the big-bang ending that the earlier events had, but the mist-spirit and her/his/its ghoul attack seemed random. Don't get me wrong, it's a good thing that you didn't explain everything. In my opinion, some amount of mystery should always remain in things like this. It's just that there was a bit too much of WAT there. And it also felt a bit rushed. Yeah. But other than that, I think you did a very nice job organising it. There were bits of utter chaos, of course, but that's unavoidable in events of such gargantuan size, even ones as well-organised as this.

As for future Kidnapped events, I can only say this: keep adding fresh new things like you did here. You've been running these for, what, two years? I don't know. My memory is terrible. Kidnapped has lost its brand new shine and it I believe there's a risk it might get a bit stale if you don't open the window and let in some fresh air, so to speak. And the innovations you came up with for this event worked wonders. Really. They were awesome.

Yes.

...

But all in all? The event was a bunch of times better than the third one. A good step in the right direction, definitely. So don't stop. Keep going.

Can't wait for Kidnapped 6.

It's hard to articulate or even think about what's off, but I guess it's because my first experience of kidnapped was kidnapped 2. All the kidnapped events I went to after never felt like kidnapped 2, and I think that was the big problem for me.

I think it's the feeling of a lack of true hostility and antagonism. I think part of the event is made by the players and their actions and Kidnapped 2 in particular had a collection of guards that really owned their roles. I do wonder if it has somewhat to do with server stagnation, because I felt like while some guards were a little aggressive there weren't many who were truly terrifying or heart-pounding in their roles. I guess it feels like guards were what made Kidnapped 2 the way it is and I don't know if we'll ever see something like that again. It happened during a different time.

I already left you feedback in the Kidnapped thread, Loxfais!